ADHd20 s04e02
===

Alison Kendrick: [00:00:00] Do you guys think we're real? What do you think? And then I said, welcome to a ADHd20, which is a podcast slash show that explores the intersection between ADHD.

Matthew Bivins: And TTRPGs

ding.

Alison Kendrick: And then there were jokes about, I stole Matt's line, and he said, that's

Matthew Bivins: That's right. I love it. Yeah.

Alison Kendrick: this Mattie B here. Good natured guy.

Matthew Bivins: I like it. Yeah.

Alison Kendrick: then Matt's internet died

Matthew Bivins: And then my internet died and now We're back

And then, Welcome to episode two, AK

Alison Kendrick: Alright, alright, alright. We What are we going to, yeah.

Matthew Bivins: Yes, we We, do have an outline. Mm-hmm.

Yes we do. it today, apparently

just not gonna get to it. We're just refuse. We refuse

everybody. So just sit

back, just

calm [00:01:00] down. we'll, we'll tell y'all what we're going to talk about when we're good and ready.

Alison Kendrick: But first It is time for tarot? Is it me you're pulling for?

Matthew Bivins: Yes, that was good.

Alison Kendrick: Thank you.

Matthew Bivins: And, everybody, I, I want you. to know that Alison Kendrick is extremely good, uh, to her word.

And, uh, in, during the last episode, she sent me a deck of tarot cards, Dungeons & Dragons, branded

tarot cards, and they arrived. And boy, that was a delight. And so, I have, I get to pull, even though I have no idea what you're gonna, you're going to, uh, tell me what to do today.

Alison Kendrick: Okay, so there is a little bit of like a ritual too,

um, to

Matthew Bivins: I need some condos? Mm-hmm.

Alison Kendrick: it's, it like what's important is that you try a few things and find what [00:02:00] feels good.

Matthew Bivins: Okay.

Alison Kendrick: Hi, Adriene.

Uh. What I do, God, this is, I can't believe I'm admitting this on air. This is so corny.

Matthew Bivins: Really?

Alison Kendrick: No, I'm totally gonna do it.

You know me, Oh, okay. open book over here. So what I do is I shuffle thrice.

Matthew Bivins: Okay.

I'll try

Alison Kendrick: And then when I finish my shuffle, I knock them to get like the spirit of the last pull out. So we go, shuff shuff shuff

Matthew Bivins: Okay.

Alison Kendrick: And then I hold them close to my chest like this, and I'm gonna breathe in and out three times. Okay? When I breathe in, I say out loud or in the stillness of my mind, I am love. And as I exhale, I say, I am light, I am love, I am light. I'm love, I'm light. I'm love. I am light. Then I'm ready to begin. And so like if I'm pulling cards for somebody else, I'll do what I did last week where like I start, you know, just kind of like shuffling.

And so I might see like if, if one pops out the way one did, ooh, the [00:03:00] Lovers is what just popped out. Um, or I might just start like, you know, kind of shuffling the deck until they say when like literally like doing this and being like, say when and then whenever I say when, that's when.

Matthew Bivins: I'm going to do that, but I still got to,

how's the sound

of knocking? These are

very dense, beautiful cards. Now I'm going to,

Alison Kendrick: Everybody take listening. Take a centering breath with us.

Matthew Bivins: I am light.

Okay, Alison, uh, here we go. I am going to start shuffling and you

going to tell when

Alison Kendrick: The chaos. I love it so much.

Matthew Bivins: Oh, God. Oh God.

Alison Kendrick: The look on your face right now. Uh,

Okay, we're gonna go with when

Matthew Bivins: Okay,

Alison Kendrick: just to cut you off your misery.

Matthew Bivins: Ooh, ooh. I know, I know. This is not really as bad

Alison Kendrick: Did you get like hanged man or devil?

Marker (Oops!)
---

Alison Kendrick: Time out. [00:04:00] It's future Alison. Hi.

Matthew Bivins: And, and future Matt.

Hi.

Alison Kendrick: We realized as we got to the end of recording this episode that we mislabeled the card that we pulled, and that's kind of a beautiful, lovely thing.

Oopsie. We just got so excited. Um, so we did. there's both a death card and the devil. Um, and so because it has this beautiful tiefling on it Yep. Matt is showing, um, I I didn't read that. This is actually the death card and not the devil Yes. that's okay. 'cause I think that maybe we saw what we wanted to see, which was the devil.

And I think that that led to some really interesting discussion that you're gonna continue to hear about if you keep on listening to this episode. Um, but we did wanna just take one quick moment to talk about death as well, which can also apply, uh, to what we're about to talk about. Because the death card is about letting go, letting go of what's no longer serving you.

I think when we talk about ADHD and death right? what we now know, future, [00:05:00] Alison and Matt spoilers having now recorded the whole episode, is that what this episode truly does become about instead of like temptation, right?

And leaning away from that as the devil might teach us to death instead is teaching us to say like, Hey, forgive yourself. Let go. Like, you don't have to keep beating yourself up over that. We've spent a lot of time beating ourselves up. You're gonna hear about some Matt on Matt and Alison on Alison violence in this episode as well. Um, and so I'm gonna officially call for like, letting go of that. If you find yourself being unkind to you, maybe that's a behavior that you can let go of,

Matthew Bivins: There There you go

Alison Kendrick: um, as we learn some new ways to master these darling little brains of ours.

Matthew Bivins: Let's do it.

Alison Kendrick: All right. Go listen to the rest of the episode now. Have fun

Matthew Bivins: Bye.

Marker (Back Into It!)
---

Alison Kendrick: What is this face you're Wow. Uh, excitement and Fear.

Matthew Bivins: So tell me what that means.

I know it's more about

change. Okay.

Alison Kendrick: Exactly. I don't, I don't read like doom or [00:06:00] gloom in any card. It's

Matthew Bivins: Pussy.

Alison Kendrick: trying to get, and now he's mansplaining tarot to me.

Wow.

Matthew Bivins: I've never said that to you! I've

Alison Kendrick: Ever.

Matthew Bivins: out loud,

Alison Kendrick: No,

Matthew Bivins: it, I had to.

I don't know. I'm joking.

Alison Kendrick: though.

So you said, what does that mean?

Tarot is about, again, it's a personal thing. It's about interpreting. So what are you seeing in this devil card?

Matthew Bivins: Yeah. So immediately it doesn't scare me too much. It's a beautiful card.

as I just showed. Uh, it doesn't scare me too much because, my spouse. Lindsay, who I've talked about many times I started calling her Tiefling

just like, 'cause my brother and his wife call each other darling and other cute names and we were like, well, we could have cute names too, but we can't take yours And so I started calling her Tiefling. And so to me, I've, I've always [00:07:00] found red, just, just tieflings to be the sexiest of all, um, D&D 5E races. And so this is like, you know, I'm not, I ain't scared on the other half though. It gets a little scully and a little bit of fire.

Mm-hmm.

So what I'm, what I'm picking up here is beautiful woman, though she is scarred.

And then a and then a fire. She is summoning flame, which

could be, uh, you know, devastating. And then sort of a, a, the other half is almost like, um, Illuminati skull

triangle circle. There is a, what looks like a sword and there what looks like some scales, like a balance.

Okay.

That's what I got. I love, absolutely. You're a natural. I'm 0% surprised. Um, the devil can [00:08:00] oftentimes be some sort of herald or warning.

Alison Kendrick: How do you wanna do this is kind of what the devil is asking. Um, and so it can be with that herald vibe like warning you to be aware, if not wary of deals being made of those you were, you know, in cahoots with. Um, or it could also just come in cahoots. Which is it could,

Matthew Bivins: Which is you, by the way.

Alison Kendrick: I know, right? Why is that? No, I was like, Oh no.

Oh, no.

Oh,

Matthew Bivins: no. Oh, no.

Alison Kendrick: so it can be warning against that. What it's really for me, especially in this, is, is an awareness. An awareness of your surroundings. What is making you feel small and trapped? Um, versus what is making you feel liberated. And then finding the balance.

Much like we decided, like, okay, we're not gonna do roll table, we're gonna dive into the dark arts of tarot this season.

Like, and that's okay. Um, maybe as long as we don't let it become every single episode

Matthew Bivins: Uh, first, uh, a small correction. Some people, [00:09:00] some people still believe that Dungeons & Dragons, uh, is,

Alison Kendrick: oh God.

Matthew Bivins: is dallying with the dark arts. Okay. Just, just, just to be clear.

So,

Alison Kendrick: to be clear, we were

Matthew Bivins: already dallying with the dark

arts, but

Alison Kendrick: we're, we're, dibbling. we're,

Matthew Bivins: we're, doubling

Alison Kendrick: We do not teach defense against the dark arts

in The Pocket Dimension.

Matthew Bivins: no, no, no, We don't. Nope.

No.

Alison Kendrick: come on in dark arts.

Matthew Bivins: Uh, we don't. What we said we were gonna do last time is that the, this card was gonna kind of speak to the topic of the, the episode. And I think this could fit quite well because

We haven't even mentioned that the topic of this episode is context switching

Alison Kendrick: you mean the devil known as context switching?

Matthew Bivins: the devil

note Context switching. Uh, context switching is, on paper, a, a benign thing

as a computer process it is

Alison Kendrick: mm-hmm.

Matthew Bivins: Natural and [00:10:00] normal. It's how we get through our

days.

But, uh, as far as product productivity goes, the days of everybody getting super excited about being a great multitasker are not just gone. They're trying to be banished. But especially unfortunately for people like us. People like us,

And especially, especially especially people like me. It's, it's funny because context, which I mean, you said, Hey, let's talk about context switching. I was like, surely we've talked about it.

Matthew Bivins: No, we haven't. It is such, It is, such, um, a cause of danger for me.

It is

a dangerous thing for me. It is. I. It is something that I have to,

that I struggle

with. And I would say that of, of the tenets of ADHD

that are on the negative

side,

Alison Kendrick: yeah.

Matthew Bivins: uh, context switching for me,

I won't

say it's full on negative. It, it may, it, it can activate my [00:11:00] depressive

states for sure. It will bring me down real fast if I find myself overwhelmed by the amount.

So

I think this card,

Alison Kendrick: yeah,

bingo.

Matthew Bivins: It's what? It's it says, you know,

let's, let's

find that balance.

Let's, okay, let's go.

Alison Kendrick: I just wanna first call out that I have this weird, I don't know if it's like a cowlick or what it is. All I see just sticking straight up in the air and I can't, every time I move my

Matthew Bivins: Yeah. You should

do what I do. Just don't even look at yourself. Just, just turn off.

Alison Kendrick: Well, but then I can't see you.

Matthew Bivins: joking.

I know I'm joking.

Alison Kendrick: It's

Matthew Bivins: Oh yeah. I've got all kinds of

Alison Kendrick: yeah, I just wanted to, to acknowledge, I don't know what my hair's doing either today.

Matthew Bivins: good. People know us. They love us.

Alison Kendrick: Yes to everything that you just said and two, like respond directly to something you just said. I don't know if I knew the words context switching before I met you.

That was something that you started to use a lot as we began to work together for the biz and the channel.

And then like, the [00:12:00] reason we thought I would make a good topic today is because if this season's kind of overarching theme is mastery, Matt and I have started to put a couple of things in our toolkit directly related to, uh, the prevention of talk to your kids today about the prevention of context switching, please before it's too late.

Matthew Bivins: Before it is too late.

Alison Kendrick: context switching. Um. I'm sorry.

Matthew Bivins: Very nice.

Very nice

Um, could you give us like the definite, because I think you have it written down, like give us, for anybody who like me pre Matt didn't know what it was, let's all start at Beauty Base Zero I.

It is a fundamental operation and multitasking operating systems that allow multiple processes or threads to share a single CPU. CPU, uh, it involves [00:13:00] saving the state of a currently running process and loading the state of another process so that the execution can continue seamlessly, uh, for those who are not developers. When you are using, uh. Pretty much in it. Let, let's talk about Gmail. If you're looking, if, if you're using pretty much any w web app. I'm, I'm trying to find the, the the easy way to explain, if you open up an email in Gmail, for example, that is the current state,

Matthew Bivins: the state of the screen, and it is like, you know, it's showing you the full, there might be an image, blah, blah, blah, you know, and, but at the same time, the code is also holding the, the sidebar and it's holding the inbox and it's waiting for you to click back to the inbox.

And, and, and so it's kind of holding that state, [00:14:00] saving the state, uh, and then, and then because of the context switching and it does it, a computer does it so well and it's meant to do it. It's like blam blam, on and off.

And, uh, it goes from saving state to loading

state,

right? Um, so that's, that's the computer.

Computers are supposed to do this. And then I don't, I don't actually know what, when it started being applied to, to, uh, human performance, um, productivity.

But, uh, you know, we are not as good at

this.

Alison Kendrick: Yeah.

Matthew Bivins: We are not

as good at context switching. And in human terms, it refers to shifting attention between different tasks or projects.

'cause unlike computers, humans experience cognitive costs

with switching tasks

And, and those costs, which I will get to in a few [00:15:00] seconds, uh, are, are, are what are what, uh, lead you to reduced focus and

productivity Yep.

So, uh, for example, number one, there is literally attention residue after switching a task, your part of your attention, uh, I know it's gross.

It's like being

sliiiiimed

Alison Kendrick: attention residue.

Matthew Bivins: There's

attention residue.

So you

you

think you've gone from, you know, working on your spreadsheet

Alison Kendrick: Mm-hmm.

Matthew Bivins: and then you check your email

and you're like, oh, I'm taking a break. There's a part of you that is still in that, in that spreadsheet and visa versa.

Alison Kendrick: Okay.

Matthew Bivins: So when you go back, you're gonna bring a little residue from the email.

Uh, and that's gonna make it harder to focus on the new thing.

Yes,

Uh, and then that, that process of, of flipping back and forth, because our brains are not meant to carry Yep. state

Alison Kendrick: Yep.

Matthew Bivins: in that same computer

[00:16:00] way, uh, with the, with the efficiency, uh, then we experience actual mental fatigue.

Alison Kendrick: Yes.

Matthew Bivins: It starts to wear us out. And, uh, each switch also incurs a time tax as our brains kind of try to reorient our itself to a new

task. So, yeah. Uh, and, and as you can already guess that this is for, neurotypical brains, more neurotypical brains, and this is going to be especially dangerous for non neurotypical brains,

uh, because

we already have a mm-hmm.

Yeah,

We already have an, an issue with where our attention should go. We already have that for everywhere, and we also, uh, already have a blindness to time.

And, and worse is we already have [00:17:00] less willpower, uh, you know,

we're we're gonna have a harder time with mental fatigue because we have less of that willpower juice, and so it's going to take more. And so context switching is bad for us.

Alison Kendrick: Yeah. That, that executive dysfunction, that, that inability to regulate, I mean, it's why I've complained on Pocket Dimension Live before. I don't usually eat lunch during the week.

Even though I am hungry

Matthew Bivins: Yeah.

Alison Kendrick: because there's a part of my brain that knows, like once I get up out of my chair and like go to the kitchen and, and switch to the context of like Alison in life making and consuming food, it's gonna be a long, long time before I get back into whatever like work mode I was in.

Matthew Bivins: Yes.

Alison Kendrick: Prior to it, it's why, you know, like we have to, you know, like have blocks during the day that we respond and even read emails or [00:18:00] are online on Slack, Discord, any of the communications tools we use. 'cause that one little, you know, like, oh, can you just take a look at this for a second? And so nobody's ever making like a big ask, right?

But like, to take us out of what we were doing, put us into something else, and then like to frame it as residue literally. But that's the thing is like,

I can't just check my email because people are like, well just monitor your email and only respond if it's a hot no. Because now what happens is I saw somebody write me an email and I, I'm only thinking about that email now and what I wanna say to that person now that I'm back in my spreadsheet, I can't rip myself away.

man.

So, yeah, so you, Matt had brought this idea of context switching and, and, and kind of like down with context switching many, many, moons ago.

Matthew Bivins: Yes. Now I will, I will back up just a second to say that there are a lot of people in the ADHD community. I know this because I, I, I had some coaching this week with a, with a group, and this, that topic about [00:19:00] lunch

happened

that the irony is that, uh, sure, yes. Getting up to eat lunch will immediately give, you know, switch context.

However, eating that lunch

Alison Kendrick: will

Matthew Bivins: improve

Alison Kendrick: my focus throughout the.

Matthew Bivins: is

also far better for our

brains

Alison Kendrick: Yes, exactly. Oh yeah. It's, it's a toxic thought that I have. I'm not

Matthew Bivins: Yeah. So,

Alison Kendrick: no.

I'm not advocating for not eating lunch. I'm telling you about the, the gremlins in my brain that

Matthew Bivins: Wow.

There's no way to not context switch,

by the way. There's no way. It's not, that's not what we're saying. You can't,

Alison Kendrick: no.

Matthew Bivins: it's, it's just the idea of trying to curb it

Alison Kendrick: Yep,

Matthew Bivins: when and where you can.

Alison Kendrick: you can. Well, and it's because there I go catastrophizing, right?

Matthew Bivins: Mm-hmm.

Alison Kendrick: what's probably gonna happen is I'm gonna get up, I'm gonna eat lunch. I'm gonna feel better. To your point,

I'm gonna come back with a refreshed and rejuvenated sense of energy and purpose in my day. But in my head I'm like, I'm gonna get lunch then. I'm not gonna be able to do this and then that's gonna happen and nobody's gonna wanna work with me.

And then I'm gonna [00:20:00] be poor and live in a box. Like I go just to the worst case scenario from

that context switching, uh,

Matthew Bivins: Lunch will do it to

Alison Kendrick: like, I'm going to eat lunch to like, nobody's gonna love me and I'm gonna live in a box. And it's like, how did, there was a, an ocean between those, those things.

But I got there in a rowboat. Uh, and that's ADHD folks. Um,

Matthew Bivins: Yeah.

Alison Kendrick: Matt and I, because of this awareness, to your point that we can't cut it completely, but there are like helps that we can give ourselves the help action.

There is our first TTRPG reference of the day.

Matthew Bivins: Let's do it.

Alison Kendrick: So one of the things that we have recently done is Matt and I, last season recorded ADHd20 on Monday afternoons.

In the middle of a work day, like between doing other work things and before doing other TPD things, we were just trying to like shove this time in.

Matthew Bivins: Mm-hmm. Shoehorn it in. And I was always finding a reason like, Ooh, I haven't showered today. My hair looks bad. Like, whatever. You know, like the [00:21:00] dumb, oh, I've got this meeting has come in.

Alison Kendrick: Oh, I, you know, like I was finding, finding excuses because it didn't naturally fit into the flow. And so we have said with this season, we now were this, we're coming to you on a Friday. We do Pocket Dimension Live. So we're already in like the flow of like content creation, Pocket Dimension things.

Matthew Bivins: Filming

Alison Kendrick: we're doing TPD Live, we're already showered, we've already done our hair, we've already picked out a cute outfit.

Matthew Bivins: Usually, yeah. Mm-hmm.

Alison Kendrick: You always look adorable.

Um,

No, you! Um, everybody, wow, we just lost the entire audience. They just walked out, I heard them exit in that moment. Um, but like, so a, there's less context switching. Now we can have more time on Monday to do work thing and like stay in the workflow until the very end of the day when it's time to do the TPD flow and like are, you know, or just putting things in.

So like I block my calendar now so I have like Pocket Dimension time and Bivins Brothers Creative time and like my own personal client work time. [00:22:00] And I try not to let them overlap so I can get into like, I got this for a four hour chunk because before I started doing that, I was just responsive to everything.

So my life was just one big context switchboard. Uh, which means nothing was getting done because I was responding to everything instead of saying, no, this is my dedicated chunk of time.

Matthew Bivins: And, and this one small change, which doesn't sound like it's a lot just

switching a day, but because our brains also get stuck more

on things like, well, it, they get stuck on all of the things they, you know, it's, it's part of the broken attention for me to worry about

bathing, wearing the right thing. Will we have time to, you know,

Alison Kendrick: Mm-hmm.

Matthew Bivins: What are we gonna talk about? Like, that is always gonna go on whether I, I, I want it to or

not. It's always

gonna happen. But by [00:23:00] removing the ev, even the reason to worry about that on a Monday, and instead just have it on a Friday.

In the morning and,

you

know, 2, 2 2 for one pop, pop, uh,

that helps. That just a

tiny little thing. It, it helps so much. You've heard of a lot of people who have the same outfit over and over and over, um, like they don't wanna think about it. Uh, we, you know, Lindsay and I love Fiestaware and we, we often buy the, the year's color of Fiestaware, but this year we took our kind of in intense amount of

plates and we cut 'em in half and put half in storage, and, and every year we'll switch 'em out.

But I cannot, I'm not joking. I cannot tell you how much easier the morning got for me to not have

Alison Kendrick: Interesting.

Matthew Bivins: to think about which plates [00:24:00] match this. And

it's such a dumb, small thing. What?

Yeah,

because they have to, because You

Alison Kendrick: the mug has to be different from the small plate. It has to be different from the big plate.

Matthew Bivins: Yeah,

it's colors and then we have to switch. So we have,

you know, she, she gets the red plate, I get the blue plate,

but then I have the red cup and she has a, you know,

Come on, it's natural. Uh, but, but yes, the, the little things by just removing 10 of my choices

Alison Kendrick: Yeah.

Matthew Bivins: was

Alison Kendrick: paralysis plus contact switching. Yeah.

Matthew Bivins: right,

right. because I'm yeah, because I'm I'm worried about it in the,

I'm, I'm trying to make, I'm, trying to make, breakfast, And so then I have to think about, oh, now, now I have to color match. I have to color design the

Alison Kendrick: I have to

Matthew Bivins: plating.

Alison Kendrick: table

Matthew Bivins: And that's a major, that

can be a

big, I.

know, and this is, okay, let me, let me also say anybody listening to this that does not have ADHD or does not know what we're talking about, we are going to sound [00:25:00] super insane

because I, when I talk and speak out loud about this stuff,

I know I sound insane. I

know that I do, but it's real. It's

so sadly, sadly so real. And so, yeah. What other, what other, what other fun things

Alison Kendrick: Um, we made a big move. We have used Slack as our team communication tool forever.

Matthew Bivins: Yes. Mm-hmm.

Alison Kendrick: And we have a, as we've mentioned on just about every episode ever of this, the most beautiful discord community that we love very much.

Um, and so sometimes it is hard to like switch back and forth between the two platforms.

So we, in the past couple weeks as a team, have made a move.

We now have the Bivins Brothers Creative Discord. It is not

Matthew Bivins: It has worked. It has worked so so well. How mu if you could guess, a percentage, how much more present am I in [00:26:00] our beautiful, uh, Pocket Dimension Discord as opposed to two weeks ago?

Alison Kendrick: 69%.

Matthew Bivins: Nice.

Alison Kendrick: Thanks.

Matthew Bivins: Maybe not that high, but definitely.

definitely. Uh, 40%.

Let's, let's, I

mean, I, I

feel like it's a big difference

'cause I'm,

I'm right there and I can, I.

Ooh,

this is nice. this is gonna bring us directly into,

uh, something that I do constantly to combat context

switching. Are you ready?

So, as a developer and just a nerd and, and knowing

that it's a problem, one of the first things I do when I'm trying to use a new piece of software is, is I try to find any part of it that can be automated or can try to reduce some of the context switching.

And, and, uh, one thing that Discord and Slack a lot of apps now do is they have this. If, if they're trying to, to [00:27:00] convey, display a large amount of information, and it could become overwhelming, which it usually does,

they give you, uh, what they usually call a quick switcher. And, and a lot of times it is command or control K Uh, just test it out.

Test it out on your, on your local chat chat app. And so I can do command K in Discord and I can bop from your channel to The Pocket Dimension channel to a channel in Pocket Dimension that is specific just by the name. So Command K, and then there on the Mac NPC, there are launchers that do the same thing. And the

idea here is that by hitting this keyboard command, which becomes, you know, just muscle memory at some point, by doing that, I am. Trying to not,

Alison Kendrick: Mm-hmm.

Matthew Bivins: if I'm typing and I, and I have a [00:28:00] thought and I need to get that, or I need to respond to someone

else,

I don't take my fingers off the keyboard, go to the mouse, find the app that I need, click on it.

All manner of things could happen to me.

Before then

I could, I could, get stuck in email.

I

could just by seeing

it, I

could see an image that I was excited about. A bear could come outta the woods and eat in my face. I mean, I literally, I

have no idea. All manner of things could happen. And, and so the, the whole idea of quick switching is, is trying to get past that.

So I'm always trying to learn, how do I get my, how do I get to my email inbox,

uh, as quickly without, without a bear eating my face.

Without a bear, eating my face. And, uh,

you know, it's, it's a

Alison Kendrick: Chicago,

Matthew Bivins: It's a, it's a real thing, man! Uh, but Yeah. I, the, the idea is what can you do to get from A to B without [00:29:00] having to dip into anything else? Don't, don't. How can you not look at your desktop? You know, a lot of people love using iPads because they're technically, basically, uh, uni-taskers

Alison Kendrick: mm-hmm.

Matthew Bivins: You see one app at one time

You don't see a bunch of windows.

Alison Kendrick: Yeah. And I'm,

Matthew Bivins: that helps.

Alison Kendrick: I'm giving. So specific to Discord. 'cause one of the other reasons we made the move was like, the more you use something, the more you learn something, the more you learn something, the more comfortable you are, the more comfortable you are. Just the

Matthew Bivins: Well, you know,

Alison Kendrick: less like work.

Um, I am somebody who is always in our discord, probably too much. I probably need to be in our Discord less. Um, but Matt and Evan were both like, ah, I could, I could learn a thing or two about Discord, like as a platform, right? Like, and so the thought was by forcing us to use it in two contexts as opposed to just randomly having Slack and then also randomly having Discord.

Like we're, [00:30:00] we're, you know, helping lock down the brain into one avenue. Um, one then challenge though that, that has opened up for me is that like, because I am so easily distracted by the shiny, like, ooh, people are talking about fun things I haven't had to yet, but the day may come where I may have to create a completely separate account to access the Bivins Brothers creative server.

So

Matthew Bivins: Mm-hmm. Hmm.

Alison Kendrick: signed into The Pocket Dimension's and all of my

Matthew Bivins: So you're having a hard time. Interesting. Interesting.

Alison Kendrick: I'm not, I'm not having a, I I won't say I'm, I'm, I've been better about managing it than I worried at first that I would be, but I'm aware of the fact that that may need to be my, like, go nuclear option because in Discord you can switch accounts.

So I might have to have like a completely locked down. It's like the same reason. And we've talked about this before in the episode last, um, season when, uh, you, when you came for me, no, when my, that's not what happened. I am kidding. But when we did talk about my phone addiction and, and that's like the reason I shared, [00:31:00] I don't get notifications for any social media platforms.

Um, because I'm already on them plenty. I don't need notification. I will be there to check it eventually.

Um. So I like that way when I pick up my phone, I'm like, I don't go like, oh, somebody responded to my Facebook post, let me go do that. Um, that could happen with me with Discord, so at some point I may have to separate them.

So when I'm doing business things, I'm in the business context, and when I'm doing fun things, I'm in the fun context. And if you're lucky like me, business and fun, there's very blurry lines between those two things, and that's how it should be.

So if you've, if this is the first time that you're hearing of context switching, try blocking your work calendar for one, like, and sit and think about it in whatever time of day is best for your brain. And then go day by day and say like, and it doesn't, like the less you can switch, the bigger the blocks can be, I think is what I'm trying to say.

The better.

Matthew Bivins: Yes.

Alison Kendrick: So try, because I've tried to do this before where it's like hour by hour and that's way too much context

Matthew Bivins: No,

Alison Kendrick: So [00:32:00]

Matthew Bivins: in fact, I ha I have thoughts, I have thoughts

about that. I I know that everybody probably knows what time blocking is, but just in case you don't, it's the concept. Apparently even Ben Franklin, he seems to be credited with the, the father of

time blocking.

Alison Kendrick: flew a kite attached to metal in a thunderstorm, he

Matthew Bivins: Yes, or because, or,

Alison Kendrick: because of it. That wasn't the ideal time to fly a kite with a key attached. You guys, I don't know.

Matthew Bivins: Uh, more recently this, this guy named Cal Newport, uh, wrote a book called Deep Work. So it, it's the concept of yes, just what you said, taking a calendar, looking at your week, finding your, the chunks of time that you want to do that kind of deep work.

Now, one thing that my coach warns against is there is time blocking where

you are, you are trying to say, from this time to

[00:33:00] this time, I want to work on this project or

this thing. There's another kind of softer concept, which may be better for the ADHD brain, uh, known as time boxing, which is I think a little bit more of what you are talking about,

which is yes, Putting up your Dukes

uh, getting a handle bar mustache.

Alison Kendrick: Battling the beat.

Matthew Bivins: I, she, she, you know, like, yeah. The beat.

Yes, battling the beat.

uh.

Alison Kendrick: Feral

Matthew Bivins: Anyway. Yeah. So s made I, okay. Yeah. Well, how I, yeah, it's really good. Um, and so yeah, so you, you, you, you box vague things.

Alison Kendrick: Yes.

Matthew Bivins: I wanna do admin work here.

Alison Kendrick: Yes.

Matthew Bivins: I wanna do creative work here. I want to do,

and that is, I cannot do blocking. I can only do boxing.

because I get into a cycle where if I don't get the thing I [00:34:00] want to be working on at that moment, done, then

I, with all that mess,

I

then add on top of it. Some, you know, Matt Bivins boxing

Alison Kendrick: Matt on

Matthew Bivins: myself, Matt

Alison Kendrick: Yeah.

Matthew Bivins: Matt Mele, Matt on Matt Boxing, and that's not good at all. You don't want that. So don't, the point is not to make yourself feel bad

Alison Kendrick: No.

Matthew Bivins: When you don't get to something, it's like,

Hey, here's the time. I know my brain. Like I have the flip brain to yours early in the morning has to be easy stuff. Uh, small wins. I can't eat the

frog or whatever they say gross,

but in the

Alison Kendrick: mm, frog legs.

Matthew Bivins: In the afternoon I can usually get into a hyperfocus phase

Alison Kendrick: Well, I thank you, I did not know that there was a distinction so what you're saying is like time blocking is more like, I'm gonna work on this project at this time,

Matthew Bivins: it, it tends to

be, it tends to be, I, I, I, you know.

Alison Kendrick: know what you like, you know, like, do you do well with seeing like [00:35:00] on your ca because like, I am such an agent of chaos that the second I put like, work on this thing, I'm, I'm like, I don't wanna, and I don't wanna do that.

But if I just have like a generic, like business development, social media, like I tend to, you know, when I think it's my idea basically versus like past me telling now me to do something.

That's my Alison on Alison violence. Um,

Matthew Bivins: man. Oh, uh, Brittany has a whole new, has a whole, she, she's been using this a lot. Your, your inner punk rock teenager.

Alison Kendrick: yeah,

Matthew Bivins: That's who's fighting you

But, but yes, to your point, there is going to be a part of your brain if you have ADHD that even if it's something you wanna do,

Alison Kendrick: Mm-hmm.

Matthew Bivins: even if it's something that is just pure joy,

Alison Kendrick: Mm-hmm.

Matthew Bivins: If you have told yourself that you're going to do this,

your inner punk teen might still fight you. And that's the stuff that that

could

bring, you know, true tears to your face [00:36:00] is that, and mine is called, Ambivalent.

And honestly, when Ambivalent comes out, I was like, okay, I just gotta walk away.

Alison Kendrick: So the big question that we asked at the top of this episode to ourselves before we hit record is, can we tie this to TTRPGs?

Matthew Bivins: Oh boy. Can we, oh

Alison Kendrick: oh boy.

Can we ever

It being conte, the concept of context switching,

Matthew Bivins: have a spicy take immediately and I, I know that people will not agree with this, but especially in the age of TTRPGs being designed every day that are trying to quote unquote solve, quote unquote issues they have with, Dungeons, & Dragons, involves. finding new mechanics for combat, let's be honest,

because combat, 'cause role-playing can be done without dice. It can be

done without [00:37:00] anything that you, I mean, you can just start talking and say,

I am stepping up to the throne and sitting down and I pull out my sword and I do a little dance.

What do

you

Alison Kendrick: shall smite you a second time.

Matthew Bivins: See, we just roleplayed. That's exactly what roleplay is.

Just kidding. Uh, but I would argue that particularly in Dungeons & Dragons, the the movement, the, the scene change from a role playing encounter to a combat encounter feels like a major

Alison Kendrick: Context switch.

Matthew Bivins: A major context switch.

If especially you, you're not as practiced, you're not as, experienced. I've seen people do it in Dungeons & Dragons extremely well, but I think our excitement over non D&D games that we've grown to love over the years, DC20, Daggerheart, that is [00:38:00] one of the main issues that a lot of these designers have, is they wanna reduce that context. Please, please go AK

Alison Kendrick: i, I you just like, and you even mentioned, just pulling back the curtain for a second, you just said you were gonna bring up combat so that, like, that part's not the new part, but those who are the best at that, both like on the streams that we watch, a la Dimension 20 and um, uh, Critical Role, et cetera, right?

As well as what we get excited about in game when you get to end on the perfect cliffhanger. We've had this beautiful role playing session. We've gotten ourselves into a pickle, and the GM says, and that's where we'll pick up next time.

Matthew Bivins: Yeah.

Alison Kendrick: The reason there is like always like a big reaction to that, but it, that it works so freaking well is because it, like, now we're on the same page.

We've had our role playing session, we're gonna take a break, we're gonna put a pin in it, and then we're going to, like, we all now know we are [00:39:00] opening next session.

So there is no context switching when you do that. And it's a beautiful, beautiful thing.

Matthew Bivins: I it is context switching because you're going from, from gaming to not gaming.

but

I think your point is, is something that, that Brittany, the coach, also tries very hard, and it's hard for us to do, but it, when you do it makes a huge, huge difference that, if you are working on something and you have to stop for whatever reason,

lunch or a meeting or something else, if you then just take a second and you write down where you are in your current space, it gives you that same, and this is where we'll pick up next time. I would also argue though, this is against what I just said, I would, I would argue that even though it is difficult, and even though it doesn't feel seamless to me, [00:40:00] to your point saying, please, roll initiative can also provide that break and then gear shift into something else.

Alison Kendrick: Yes.

Matthew Bivins: My point is just I don't always want that. I don't, I don't always want that level of.

Alison Kendrick: Interesting.

Matthew Bivins: roll initiative. Okay. Now we're doing a completely different thing. I'm still in the, you

know, but I'm still in the zone.

but, but yeah. Brittany says all the time, she's like, you wanna help with this? Just write down like a sentence of where you are

Alison Kendrick: Yeah.

Matthew Bivins: So that you know where you are when you come back And you're not, it doesn't stay with you.

You know, you've put it down.

Alison Kendrick: I just, when you said all of that, it, I made, it made me realize I may need to flip my perspective. A lot of times I will use something like a break or food or what have you, as like the reward for finishing the thing. You have to be careful with when you would do this, but it's almost like if [00:41:00] you flipped it for like, I'm gonna take a break now, so I get to come back like it.

Maybe if, you know, you're like close to like finishing something like, so that I get to complete this after work. So I get to like.

Put the cherry on whatever this sundae is

Matthew Bivins: Oh, man.

Alison Kendrick: break. Like give, because that's the thing, like give yourself an exciting cliffhanger

Matthew Bivins: Mm-hmm.

Alison Kendrick: to your point, as long as you can come back to it if you like, because you don't wanna, like we've talked about hyperfocus and flow and things like that, so that's not what

Matthew Bivins: That's not what we're talking about. Yeah.

Alison Kendrick: But when you are starting to like, fight it much like, you know, you've played D&D with your friends for three hours now it's starting to feel a little sloggy like, and that's where we'll pick up next time. Ah, ah, now I'm re-engaged. I'm entertained again because you've, you've dangled the carrot. I'm gonna dangle the carrot at myself.

Imma be my own mastermind. I'm not gonna have an inner punk. I'm gonna have an inner puppet master.

Matthew Bivins: Oh dang. Oh dang. Well, this is, I mean, this is why number one, things like the [00:42:00] Pomodoro technique

work with timers, because again, you've got, here's 20 and then here's

five and, and two, I mean, you're an advanced student, obviously, but even like people like Hemingway, who apparently, well, Hemingway was a man for stories, but Hemingway, you know, apparently would write and never, and never stop at a point

that he knew. So he would always write to, he would stop right before he got to a point where he knew what was happening next. So he

knew the next day he's gonna sit down

Alison Kendrick: Pick up.

Matthew Bivins: and start right there.

Alison Kendrick: Okay.

Oh, we've solved so many problems today, Mattie.

Matthew Bivins: God, I wish, I wish it would always work. It, it's definitely like muscles and habits that you have to work on, but man, when it works, it works. So it does help so much.

Alison Kendrick: Yeah.

Matthew Bivins: It

Alison Kendrick: Well this is the big, you know, thing too that's coming out of this podcast is [00:43:00] Matt and I learning how to advocate for ourselves.

Matthew Bivins: Hmm mm

Alison Kendrick: Um, and hopefully in turn, you dear listener, doing the same, like learning how to say, Hmm, I don't do well with meetings at that time. Or you know, like, I need to protect my Tuesdays.

Like figure out a baby step. Don't boil the ocean. Don't try and do everything at once,

Matthew Bivins: Mm-hmm.

Alison Kendrick: But like, pick one thing in your schedule, um, that you can affect and just see how you feel. Just see what happens if you know, we all know. Nothing's happening Friday afternoon.

Come

Matthew Bivins: Mm-hmm.

Alison Kendrick: block your Friday afternoon calendar. Do it. I dare you do it and tell us how good it feels.

Matthew Bivins: Do it.

Yeah.

Alison Kendrick: I.

Matthew Bivins: Yeah. And if you Are if you're the kind of person that, that lets meetings just willy-nilly your whole day, you do have the power a lot of times to say, okay, it's gonna suck, but I am

only doing

meetings from two to five. I mean, that is going to be brutal.

However, how much [00:44:00] better is that than

Alison Kendrick: Yep.

Matthew Bivins: because, you know, if I have, if I have scattered meetings,

I, I

cannot work, I cannot get done.

Alison Kendrick: Nope. And bonus point, you can get meetings that should have been emails to end if you have to jump to another meeting.

Matthew Bivins: Bang.

Alison Kendrick: So you might as well stack 'em.

Matthew Bivins: Stack 'em to the heavens!

Alison Kendrick: The

Matthew Bivins: Stack 'em to the heavens

Alison Kendrick: meeting is to have to go to another meeting. Uh,

this was fun. I like, I, I am glad that you have, you were the one that introduced me to the concept of, I, I knew what context switching was.

I just didn't know the name for it and how much it affected me until you,

so thank you, Matthew.

Matthew Bivins: You're welcome

yeah, you're welcome. I think,

yeah, it's, it is,

you know. We're all, we're all here together. And if if anybody has, that's listening to this, has some, uh, killer tips and tricks. I joke now, ever since we [00:45:00] started this podcast that my entire life is, is tricking myself to

work. I'm not ashamed of it, but it is true also that I, I have come to the, you know, I've, I've come to the realization and the acceptance of the fact that I, I have to trick myself

all all day to get from A to B

to B all day. So if you, listener, have some tips and tricks that you could share that would help me trick myself, please let us know.

Alison Kendrick: We're listening, reading, watching I'm literally listening right now.

Wow, we were full creepy this episode. Thanks for tuning in. Even when we do and say creepy shit, everybody tune in next time when we will definitely say and do more creepy shit.

Matthew Bivins: Oh my gosh. We, we most definitely will. Can't stop, don't stop.